Ross says RTÉ must address pulled interview, insists McDonald book not a 'hatchet job'

ireland
Ross Says Rté Must Address Pulled Interview, Insists Mcdonald Book Not A 'Hatchet Job'
Shane Ross' Mary Lou McDonald biography is causing a stir after its publication last week.
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James Cox

Shane Ross has said RTÉ must answer questions on why an interview about his new book Mary Lou McDonald: A Republican Riddle was pulled, and denied claims he is an opponent of Ms McDonald or her party.

The national broadcaster's decision to pull the interview with the journalist and former independent government minister has courted plenty of controversy this week.

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It even made the Dáil, where Taoiseach Micheál Martin said the move was "chilling" in terms of public discourse.

Speaking on Thursday, Mr Martin clarified his comments and admitted claims Sinn Féin had received access to the interview were inaccurate.

“I got that wrong, in terms of the prior access," Mr Martin told the Pat Kenny show on Newstalk. “The key point I was making is that when political parties start suing the national broadcaster it does have a chilling effect.

“It’s a bit hard to look at the Shane Ross saga in isolation and say that there’s no connection with the fact that RTÉ are being sued and that there is a defamation case against them. It does have a chilling effect on media and on broadcasters."

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Speaking to BreakingNews.ie, Mr Ross said that RTÉ should answer questions about the interview at the Oireachtas media committee.

"I appreciate what he [Micheál Martin] said. I think it is very important that RTÉ is brought in by the committee or a forum is found where they must answer questions about what happened, because what happened was pretty alarming from my point of view.

"It distracted a lot of the story, this is meant to be the story of Mary Lou McDonald, and different areas of her life. It's not a hatchet job, in many ways she's a mystery... and I wanted to tell the story about her childhood, where she came from, what makes her tick, and stuff people hadn't heard before.

"I can't understand why RTÉ are so incredibly protective about it, and what the Taoiseach said was correct. It is chilling that they treat one party in a different way to the others.

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"I'm doing an interview with you now, and you never asked for any kind of reassurance about this, that and the other, or put anything out of bounds... I've done interviews with Newstalk and other stations and nobody has asked for any pre-conditions at all."

Speaking to BreakingNews.ie, Mr Ross said that RTÉ should answer questions about the interview at the Oireachtas media committee.

Some have questioned whether Mr Ross, who served in government while Ms McDonald was in opposition, and in opposition at the same time as her, is a good candidate to write a biography.

However, he denied claims he was a "political opponent" of Ms McDonald.

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"I'm an independent, I'm not a political opponent of hers by right. I was in government when she was in opposition, but I was also in opposition when she was in opposition. At that time we combined extremely well on the Public Accounts Committee where she was a force for good.

"We worked very hard to make various bodies who came in accountable, very specifically in the book I say she was a force for good in this. There's a chapter called 'A Star Takes the Dáil by Storm'... so it's not a hatchet job. I'm not a political opponent of hers. The book is critical in places but also complimentary in places.

"As far as personal relationship goes, it was always very good, although I haven't met her in the last year or so. I think that was unfair. I know Sinn Féin would like to control the message and say they didn't approve of me writing a biography, but it's far more independent than what would have come out as an authorised one."

One chapter in the book looks at how Ms McDonald and her husband Martin Lanigan financed the refurbishment of their Cabra home, initially a bungalow.

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Some have criticised Mr Ross for this, claiming it is an invasion of the couple's privacy, however, he fully defended the "legitimate questions" he asked.

"There are two things here: Mary Lou quite rightly demands transparency from other people. She must set the same standards for herself.

"I'm not suggesting she did anything wrong here, I'm just asking the question: where did the money come from for this very dramatic refurbishment of the house? In the book there is a very visible set of photographs of the size of the bungalow when they bought it and what it looked liked finished, it was unrecognisable.

"At the time she didn't have a big income, she wasn't in the European Parliament or the Dáil when they bought it, and her husband's income was modest too. You do have to ask that question, you wouldn't be human if you didn't say 'where did this money come from?'

"There wasn't any sign of it, so I'm just saying, 'tell us, you'd ask other people that?'"

Another area of Ms McDonald's private life the book covers is her father, Patrick McDonald, and different issues he was involved in.

While Mr Ross acknowledged she may see this as an "interference" in her private life, he said family background is crucial to any biography, while he added that some of the incidents involving Mr McDonald were already covered in newspapers.

"I sympathise with her about that, she probably regards what I did in writing about that as an interference in her private life. The thing is, first of all her background is essential, for any biography you can't leave out their parents, brothers and sisters, or even grandparents, because that's an important part of their formation."

In relation to her father, Mr Ross says the problem about the privacy with him "was the fact he talked about a lot of these things himself".

"The scrapes he got into were sometimes court actions which were all covered by the media. I'm not actually exposing anything new, I'm just saying 'this guy happens to be Mary Lou McDonald's father'."

Mr Ross' book looks at what he describes as the "secretive" nature of Sinn Féin, and he speaks about his difficulty in securing interviews with TDs and other party members. Another section details his efforts to organise an interview with Gerry Adams.

Mr Ross says he believes the party will have to change if they end up in government.

"Sinn Féin is a very secretive organisation, but I was keen to address her relationship with the people who were members of the IRA and see whether they had any influence on her.

"That's something which is difficult to determine, I think in the past certainly the influence of Gerry Adams over her was very strong, and I don't think it was a force for good. I'm very hopeful that now she's released from the position of being his deputy, that she will lead Sinn Féin on a more constitutional path.

"I think their secrecy is a great disadvantage in terms of transparency, and it's very difficult for them to demand transparency from others when they're not transparent enough themselves.

"The discipline with which they resisted giving me interviews, openly on the record at least, was extraordinary, and it was unique. That broke down after a time and a lot of them spoke to me off the record.

"They are not prepared to go the way of being more open like a lot of other political parties. Secrecy is their default position unfortunately, and I think they're going to have to be a lot more transparent."

Her Fianna Fáil background is something that she is constantly trying to downplay.

Another part of Ms McDonald's career which the book covers is her brief involvement with Fianna Fáil.

Mr Ross said this is something she consistently looks to downplay, pointing to an interview with Sinn Féin newspaper An Phoblacht in which she said she was never a member of the party.

"At one stage in An Phoblacht she said she was never a member of Fianna Fáil, in another interview she said she was, so there is a straight contradiction. Her Fianna Fáil background is something that she is constantly trying to downplay. She talks about going along to meetings with a couple of friends, she did much more than that, she played a very active role in Fianna Fáil for a short period of time, around 18 months.

"She spoke at the Ard Fheis in 1998, which is a prize position, and she spoke on the republican side. People in Fianna Fáil remember her very well, and this is consistent with what she says about her belief, as being too republican for them, the reason she gives for leaving.

"It would be far better for her if she said 'yeah, I was there for 18 months and I played an active role, my family was Fianna Fáil, and so I joined', and is more open on it rather than closing down on it."

Adams' influence on Ms McDonald, and Sinn Féin, is something which Mr Ross looks at in detail, and he believes she would be best served in addressing these issues before becoming taoiseach.

"The Adams influence is one which Mary Lou ought to feel uncomfortable about. It forced her into positions of great difficulty, in relation to the Máiría Cahill rape, which she backed the Adams position on, she back him on Jean McConville, she said she believes him when he said he wasn't in the IRA. On the Slab Murphy issue she echoed Adams and called him a good republican.

"She hasn't parted with him on these points and I don't think that is to her credit. Of course, to get the leadership, there was no way she could split with Adams. When and if she becomes Taoiseach she will constantly be reminded of these things.

"There's a chapter in the book called 'Playing the Cemetery Game'... constantly going to commemorations and funerals, carrying coffins, for IRA volunteers. That is something which she will just have to live with, and they'll hang those things around her neck forever.

"All the awkward questions should be answered at this stage because she'll come under more and more scrutiny. While she's in opposition and at the height of her powers rather than waiting until she gets into government. Like everyone in government she'll be assailed on every side every day.

"She'd be better off coming out and saying, 'look, this is what my relationship with Gerry Adams was like, I did this for various reasons', and maybe regretting one or two, that's very difficult because people in Sinn Féin never seem to turn back or regret anything about the IRA. As time passed they might be able to be a little bit more remorseful about what happened."

Shane Ross insists his biography of Mary Lou McDonald is not a 'hatchet job'.

Mr Ross said the primary goal of his biography is to "fill in the gaps" in Ms McDonald's life and career.

He hopes for it to be judged as a fair assessment of the woman who looks certain to be Ireland's first Sinn Féin, and female, leader.

"I talked to her about it, she wasn't very enthusiastic.

"It's an unauthorised biography, I didn't want to write an unauthorised biography. I thought she might have helped me, gave me an interview.

"I hope it's seen as independent, objective, and balanced. On both sides they're criticising it, some are saying 'you were far too positive about her' there are good things I said, others are saying 'you were always against Sinn Féin, in opposition'.

"When I was in government they supported the two most controversial issues that I championed as minister, the judges and drink-driving, and I got full support from Sinn Féin for both for which I am very grateful, much more than I got from most of my Fine Gael colleagues in government.

"I found them good to work with on those issues, I would like people to know my relationship with them was good. My hope would be people would say it's subjective in parts, very critical on the IRA military side and their relationship there, but recognising that Mary Lou is an influence for good in many areas, maybe in particular in Sinn Féin itself.

"As the first sentence of the book says 'Mary Lou never wore a balaclava', that's a really good thing and the right type of person to have in charge of the party."

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